Cloudy Swimming Pool

Albert · Post by **Albert** » Thu 26 Apr 2012 14:32

I would welcome some advice. My pool is cloudy, and I have read up on solutions, but can't seem to find one. The Ph reading is now good, (about 7.4) and I have shocked the pool twice now, and given it a good old dose of anti-algae/flocculent, but problem not yet solved.

I am running the filtration for about 12 hours a day, and just hoping it will clear, eventually!

It's a 8mx4m oval Desjoyeaux pool, about 50m3, below ground.

Anyone got any ideas?

Allan · Post by **Allan** » Thu 26 Apr 2012 17:44

You are doing all the right things. Floculant is normally the best cure for cloudy water as it sticks tiny particles together so you can filter them out or vacuum them up. If it is working you normally end up with dirty scum at the bottom of the pool. Often combined products don't focus enough on the floculant.

Another cause of cloudy water can be total alkalinity - have you checked it.

rogb · Post by **rogb** » Thu 26 Apr 2012 23:30

If the cloudiness persists, you could try leaving the filter off for 24 hours, to give the flocc a better chance to precipitate the cloudiness out onto the bottom of the pool in peace and quiet.

I've also had to vacuum twice to get rid of all the dead algae after cloudiness incidents.

Albert · Post by **Albert** » Fri 27 Apr 2012 16:07

Allan wrote:
Another cause of cloudy water can be total alkalinity - have you checked it.

Thanks for the advice. Yes I have. It may be a tad low, so keeping my eye on it.

No progress so far!!!

Have added more chlorine today, so am looking for an improvement. I am concerned about adding more floculent, as I may have OD'd before.

Allan · Post by **Allan** » Fri 27 Apr 2012 16:13

It's hard to O/D on floculant.

Has your pool got a cover - you might try aerating it.

A bit like a fizzy drink, if you shake it you release CO2 - this lowers the PH and removes scale particulates from the water

Allan · Post by **Allan** » Fri 27 Apr 2012 16:15

Have you checked your filter is working properly - do you have a pressure gauge - if so it it normal?

russell · Post by **russell** » Sat 28 Apr 2012 10:18

Allan wrote:Have you checked your filter is working properly - do you have a pressure gauge - if so it it normal?

...and have you backwashed it?

Russell.

Albert · Post by **Albert** » Sat 28 Apr 2012 18:51

Update.

The filtration system is a unit which is attached to the end of the pool. It uses a "poche", (Brand new, I have changed it) and the pump is working very well. So think all is well in that regard.

Took a sample of water to Desyoyeaux today and they determined that all was OK except the free chlorine, which was absent.

As I shocked the pool twice, this was disappointing, but they put this down to me buying cheap chlorine from Intermarche.

Have changed the poche again, to a very fine filter, and added their chlorine, and have to wait a few days to see what happens.

I will advise. Thanks for the interest and help.

Allan · Post by **Allan** » Sat 28 Apr 2012 19:04

The whole point of shocking the pool is that the chlorine doesn't stay in it and should have little effect on free chlorine. A shock is a rapid disinfection and free chlorine shouldn't have a bearing on cloudiness. I can't seriously believe the. Comment about 'cheap' chemicals. Most pool chemicals are just generic compounds and are usually hideously overpriced.

Try aerating the pool - let some water out and refill it, point the hose up in the air and let the water fall into the pool

Albert · Post by **Albert** » Sat 28 Apr 2012 21:18

All I can do is keep trying. His comment about cheap chemicals is explained by his need to sell his own product. I am loathe to empty/refill because of water restrictions which I think are still in place here in the Gard.

Allan · Post by **Allan** » Sat 28 Apr 2012 22:49

If your pump has a pre-filter with a removable cover then try loosening the cover slightly. That way air gets sucked in and you should see bubbles entering the pool at the water inlets.

russell · Post by **russell** » Sun 29 Apr 2012 12:27

What colour is the cloudiness? If it green then you have live algae. If it is white then the chlore choc has done its job and killed the algae.

If it dead algae in suspension add a solution of flocculant directly to the water with a watering can run the pump for an hour or so to mix it then leave it without pumping foor 24 hours. You should then find a loose deposit at the bottom that you can gently siphon out, preferably to waste and not through the filter.

Bon chance.

Russell.

Albert · Post by **Albert** » Sun 29 Apr 2012 20:14

It isn't green, just cloudy. Just can’t see the bottom of the pool. I have been running the filter continuously now, with more chlorine, since yesterday around Midday, with no sign of improvement. I have redirected the water coming out of the filter to the surface, creating a lot of turbulence/bubbles, but although I feel I am adding some oxygen to the pool, it is again, with little improvement.

I think that the next stage is, as suggested, more flocculent, but I am not confident.

Having said all that, it is all good experience, and I am very appreciative of the help and advice.

Next step maybe to upload some photos, so you guys can see what it is I am dealing with.

rogb · Post by **rogb** » Sun 29 Apr 2012 23:58

I agree with Russell that if and when you add more flocculent, filter only for an hour or two to mix it in- then switch off the filter for 12 - 24 hours to give the dead algae, ie the cloudiness, a chance to bind together and sink to the bottom.

Albert · Post by **Albert** » Mon 30 Apr 2012 07:11

Will do. Can't vacuum to waste though as I do not have that kind of filtration system. I will have to suck the stuff into the bag and then empty/clean the bag as per normal. Fingers crossed!

russell · Post by **russell** » Mon 30 Apr 2012 16:38

I suspect that is your problem, if the bag filter isn't fine enough the dead algae will pass through it, get mixed up and you are back to square one! If it is fine enough to catch the algae it will most mikely get clogged. If you don't have a sand filter you really need to figure out some means of sucking the deposit at the bottom out into a drain.

Russell.

Albert · Post by **Albert** » Tue 01 May 2012 09:48

I guess we all make mistakes when we don't fully understand what we are doing.

This morning the water was clear, and so I rigged up the vacuum, hoping that the outflow pipe (which directs water from the filter bag back into the pool) would not disturb the bottom too much. After a couple of minutes the pool was cloudy again - the circulation system worked too well and all the debris was floating around again.

Apparently, so I have learned, after the event, you are not supposed to use flocculent in a Desjoyeaux pool as the system has no facility to vacuum to waste and all that.

Apparently it's all about letting the filtration system do its work.

Thanks for all the help again. At least I am gaining experience, although we never had these problems when my wife had the job of maintaining the pool!

russell · Post by **russell** » Tue 01 May 2012 12:17

Albert wrote: Apparently, so I have learned, after the event, you are not supposed to use flocculent in a Desjoyeaux pool as the system has no facility to vacuum to waste and all that.

That's nonsense. If you need floculent you need it! How else can you get rid of dead algae?
Can you rig up some sort of connection to fit a hose into the filter outlet to pump the sucked up muck into a drain (or to water the garden)?

Russell.

Albert · Post by **Albert** » Tue 01 May 2012 16:31

Yes, it is rather crazy. I am thinking along the same lines - clearly the floc worked, and the trick is to get the dead algae out without too much disturbance to the bottom of the pool. Must be a lot of people having had the same problem!!

Allan · Post by **Allan** » Tue 01 May 2012 17:29

Albert wrote: Apparently, so I have learned, after the event, you are not supposed to use flocculent in a Desjoyeaux pool as the system has no facility to vacuum to waste and all that.

Apparently it's all about letting the filtration system do its work.

I agree with Russell; whoever told you that doesn't know anything about swimming pools! Floculant simply binds together the microscopic particles so they are more easily filtered ( whether with a vacuum hose or normal filtration ).

Desjoyeaux actually sell floculant http://www.laboutiquedesjoyaux.fr/produ ... scine.html

Vacuuming to waste is a side issue, it is simply a way of bypassing your filter to get rid of particularly dirty water.

What seems to be the issue in your case is that your filter isn't working, so you are vacuuming up the dirty deposit and instead of staying in your filter it is being put straight back into the pool. Accorning to Desjoyaux, they have filters from 6 microns to 30 microns. A six micron filter should easily cope with algae treated with floculant.

It clearly isn't so I would replace it.

Albert · Post by **Albert** » Tue 01 May 2012 20:23

I understand the issue about the filter bag, which is why I bought the 6 micron bag last week direct from them. This is the one in use, so I am hopeful.

Thanks.

Albert · Post by **Albert** » Tue 08 May 2012 20:51

Update:

The 6 micron bag is holding its own, and slowly, very slowly, the water is beginning to clear. I would use Flocculent again, if only I had a way of removing the algae. However the Desjoyeaux system does not allow for this.

Thanks for all the help. I feel I am winning, but as I said, it's very slow.

Allan · Post by **Allan** » Tue 08 May 2012 23:38

This still makes no sense at all.

Think of it this way, the flocculant makes the tiny particles in your water stick together into bigger particles. These bigger particles should be more easily trapped by your filter.

If you turn the pump off, these bigger particles tend to sink to the bottom of the pool. If you then vacuum your pool then the debris from the bottom is sucked through your filter.

If your filter is working then using flocculant should trap these particles in the filter, it ultimately doesn't matter if you get them there by vacuuming or by normal circulation.

It is hard to conclude anything other than your filter doesn't work.

russell · Post by **russell** » Wed 09 May 2012 15:21

Albert wrote:Update:
I would use Flocculent again, if only I had a way of removing the algae. However the Desjoyeaux system does not allow for this.

Maybe not as it stands but it must be possible to arrange something. When you pump through the filter the water must be returned to the pool. I'm sure, with a bit of ingenuity, you could divert this return stream.

Algae particles can be as small as 1 micron so, unless they are clumped, the filter won't catch them.

Russell.

Albert · Post by **Albert** » Fri 11 May 2012 15:30

I am working on this with my neighbour. I will take a photo of the heath-robinson affair next Monday when we give it a go. Flocculent in tomorrow, then the pool will be at rest on Saturday afternoon until Monday afternoon. And then....

Sue · Post by **Sue** » Fri 11 May 2012 16:44

Bon chance!

Albert · Post by **Albert** » Mon 14 May 2012 12:58

Bit of a mixed result. The Flocculent did its job. However it takes the smallest movement to disturb the algae resting on the bottom of the pool, so before you know it, quite a lot is rising in the water, and making it look cloudy again.

The "experiment" was successful, (in that the water taken up via hoovering was expelled out of the pool) but I was not left with sparkling clear water.

So, system back in place, chlore choc added, and let the pump go for 48 hours continuous. I have a 6 micron bag, but fear I have 1-5 micron algae.

If you add more flocculent, (i.e., more than is recommended, or considered necessary under normal circumstances) will the algae particles combine to produce bigger "clumps" (i.e. 7 microns or more)??

Just a thought.

All is not lost, by any means, but this is no quick fix.

Pictures at www.myhrshop.co.uk/pool.doc

russell · Post by **russell** » Mon 14 May 2012 16:44

Albert wrote:Bit of a mixed result. The Flocculent did its job. However it takes the smallest movement to disturb the algae resting on the bottom of the pool, so before you know it, quite a lot is rising in the water, and making it look cloudy again.

The flocculent should continue to work so you could try leaving it to settle a bit longer. I had the same problem once and had to be very gentle with the hoovering.

Russell.

rogb · Post by **rogb** » Mon 14 May 2012 22:03

Yes, it's difficult not to stir up the algae on the bottom and two or even three hoovers may be needed. But there's less to hoover each time.

Albert · Post by **Albert** » Tue 15 May 2012 20:58

Latest development. My neighbour dropped into Desjoyeaux today and discussed the problem. He sold him (for me) some tablets - 13 Euros. What they are supposed to do is to line the filter bag so that algae cannot penetrate and go back into the water after filtration. All I have to do is to make sure that the bag is cleaned regularly, and keep doing this until the water is clear.

Sounds logical, and should work.

www.myhrshop.co.uk/pool2.doc

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Cloudy Swimming Pool

Cloudy Swimming Pool