Reverse Climatisation

Helen · Post by **Helen** » Sun 21 Sep 2014 21:16

I'd like to hear any experiences/thoughts about installing reverse climatisation. I've read that it's economical - is that the case? Also, how effective is it when used to heat a living room - would it work as the main heat source in, say, a living room?

More generally, any recommendations/advice about where to buy a system and how to get it installed?

Allan · Post by **Allan** » Sun 21 Sep 2014 22:07

Reversible air-conditioning is typically 3 or 4 times more efficient than conventional electric heating. The different models normally have a stated COP (coefficient of performance), the higher the better. We have an open plan living area of 110 sq metres and we heat that with reversible climat so yes it should easily heat a living room.

Those that use 'Inverter' technology are generally more efficient and quieter.

And of course in summer you can use it as conventional air-conditioning.

Just make sure that you buy a unit adequately sized for the room, make sure the installer knows it should be sized for heating, not just cooling.

Some have built in programmers and you can get an attachment that lets you turn them on remotely with a mobile phone

Jeanne-Marie Turner · Post by **Jeanne-Marie Turner** » Mon 22 Sep 2014 09:01

Thoroughly recommend it. Expensive to install, cheap as a heating unit to run. More expensive as a climatisation unit. Only of use then if all windows and doors are closed in summer. We have a large house and each unit only runs 3 heaters/climatisation maximum so are still waiting to have another installed for our large sitting room where our ancient storage heater has given up the ghost and at around £3000 per unit it will not be cheap as we have two units installed already. We need our heating allowance from our pensions to pay for the installations. At around £200 per year it does not pay much towards a unit but we still recommend this system for efficient use of energy.

Sue · Post by **Sue** » Mon 22 Sep 2014 09:40

No pensioner's heating allowance this year Jeanne-Marie. The British Government has decided that we don't need it as France has a warmer climate than UK!!

Allan · Post by **Allan** » Mon 22 Sep 2014 10:03

I don't think you could ever justify climat reversible purely on running cost savings but it is a very comfortable and efficient (at heating) form of heat.

With the added bonus of providing air-conditionining

The system has both internal and external units and some external units can support multiple internal units. If you just want it in one room then expect it to cost less than the amount that Jeanne-Marie suggests.

Smiley G · Post by **Smiley G** » Mon 22 Sep 2014 10:07

In response to Sue's post, I'm sure the Winter Fuel Allowance is protected until 2015 meaning for this winter, 2014 - 2015, those eligible will receive it

Jeanne-Marie Turner · Post by **Jeanne-Marie Turner** » Mon 22 Sep 2014 10:10

How sad. We need it for air conditioning. However, who said this climate is warmer than the UK? We have had snow 2 feet deep, worst, it brings the power lines down so no electricity either. We have had to rely on candles and a log fire for up to a week before now. We have had the worst summer here this year for 28 years.
We are taking the caravan to Morocco for January, February and March again this coming year. We went last year and found most of French pensioners there in their huge camper vans enjoying Marrakech at 30 degrees plus in January.
Also, our so called index linking has not kept up with the rising cost of living as once promised some twenty years back.
A letter needs to be sent to the government. They are driving 'The old age' to travel further and further south.
I also believe that index linking on government pensions should be applicable to all parts of the world in retirement which at present, it is not.

Jeanne-Marie Turner · Post by **Jeanne-Marie Turner** » Mon 22 Sep 2014 10:22

In response to Allans suggestion. We only need one unit for our large sitting room so maybe an internal unit will be sufficient. We will look into this. Thank you for the suggestion.

Allan · Post by **Allan** » Mon 22 Sep 2014 11:00

Jeanne-Marie Turner wrote:In response to Allans suggestion. We only need one unit for our large sitting room so maybe an internal unit will be sufficient. We will look into this. Thank you for the suggestion.

Just to clarify, you always have both an indoor and an outdoor unit but the cost is in part determine by how many indoor units are supported by the outdoor unit.

Helen · Post by **Helen** » Mon 22 Sep 2014 11:23

My entire apartment is only 50 m2 so one unit should suffice

At the moment I'm on a fact-finding mission, weighing up options - primarily to get approval from the owners' AGM/syndic later this year. So a big thank you for the input above!

But I do need to do some number crunching to see if it'll be worth it in the longer term

Jeanne-Marie Turner · Post by **Jeanne-Marie Turner** » Mon 22 Sep 2014 11:24

Thank you. Our two outdoor units are at the back of the house and the main sitting room requires a unit too far away from those installed at the rear of the house so maybe we will have to have an external unit that runs a further 2 or 3 units from it at the front of the house. I guess it will not be cheap. So far we go to Morocco and escape the worst of the winters but as we get older this may not be so possible.

Allan · Post by **Allan** » Mon 22 Sep 2014 11:43

Helen wrote:My entire apartment is only 50 m2 so one unit should suffice

At the moment I'm on a fact-finding mission, weighing up options - primarily to get approval from the owners' AGM/syndic later this year. So a big thank you for the input above!

But I do need to do some number crunching to see if it'll be worth it in the longer term

If it takes 4KW of heat for the apartment then the most you will save is about 40 centimes an hour, if it costs €2400 to install then you would need to run it at full belt for 6,000 hours to get your money back. Assuming winter of 5 months and heating on 6 hours a day then it would be at least 6 years before you saw your money back. In addition the unit will need servicing and you are unlikely to run it at full belt for long periods so the pay back time is even longer - more realistically 10 years or more.

As I said earlier, you can rarely justify it on cost grounds alone but if your apartment is hot and uncomfortable in summer then you might welcome air conditioning with low cost heating as a winter bonus.

Helen · Post by **Helen** » Mon 22 Sep 2014 12:12

you can rarely justify it on cost grounds alone but if your apartment is hot and uncomfortable in summer then you might welcome air conditioning with low cost heating as a winter bonus.

Wow Allan - thank you. You've certainly clarified my thinking. It would definitely be falling into the 'nice to have' option, rather than any sensible ROI.

Post by **Kate** » Mon 22 Sep 2014 19:52

Here' s a very old article from when we had our clim installed, following the installation. So old that photos don't enlarge but you get the général idea
http://www.anglophone-direct.com/Air-co ... allation-a

Santiago · Post by **Santiago** » Tue 23 Sep 2014 07:12

We had them installed when we built our apartment. I'd agree with Allen. They are very useful and a nice, hassle-free way to heat and cool a property. Expensive to install, especially into an existing home. Unfortunately, our Sanyo external unit broke down and they no longer sell them or supply parts in France so I'm stuck with replacing the whole system, but I will probably do it. Another thing they do is run several internal units off a single external. Good for places with many rooms.

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Reverse Climatisation

Reverse Climatisation

Winter Fuel Allowance